Joe Grundy

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Posts by Joe Grundy

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  70

  How Far Apart Were Your Legs?

  by Joe Grundy in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  several threads on here about the excellent bbc r4 programme this week ('the report') focussing on rape and abuse in barry, south wales, jws.

  fat pervert mark sewell later got 14 years and i hope he is enjoying every minute of it.. the courageous ladies who spoke on the programme were articulate, reasonable and made a tremendous impression.. the quote in the thread title made an impression on me, and i hope, on all listeners.. forget religious, theological, 'biblical' issues and cut to the basics.

  a rape victim was asked to demonstrate - to demonstrate, ffs - to three unqualified (middle-aged at least, presumably) men just how far her legs were apart when she was raped.. i have rarely heard anything so outrageous, and i used to investigate rape and abuse in my profession.

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  Joe Grundy

  PS: Feel uncomfortable about the thread title? Good. Now think about how you would feel if you were the victim. Oh, and as I understand it a woman can't wear trousers in front of a JC, can she?
  
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  70

  How Far Apart Were Your Legs?

  by Joe Grundy in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  several threads on here about the excellent bbc r4 programme this week ('the report') focussing on rape and abuse in barry, south wales, jws.

  fat pervert mark sewell later got 14 years and i hope he is enjoying every minute of it.. the courageous ladies who spoke on the programme were articulate, reasonable and made a tremendous impression.. the quote in the thread title made an impression on me, and i hope, on all listeners.. forget religious, theological, 'biblical' issues and cut to the basics.

  a rape victim was asked to demonstrate - to demonstrate, ffs - to three unqualified (middle-aged at least, presumably) men just how far her legs were apart when she was raped.. i have rarely heard anything so outrageous, and i used to investigate rape and abuse in my profession.

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  Joe Grundy

  Several threads on here about the excellent BBC R4 programme this week ('The Report') focussing on rape and abuse in Barry, South Wales, JWs. Fat pervert Mark Sewell later got 14 years and I hope he is enjoying every minute of it.

  The courageous ladies who spoke on the programme were articulate, reasonable and made a tremendous impression.

  The quote in the thread title made an impression on me, and I hope, on all listeners.

  Forget religious, theological, 'biblical' issues and cut to the basics. A rape victim was asked to demonstrate - TO DEMONSTRATE, FFS - to three unqualified (middle-aged at least, presumably) men just how far her legs were apart when she was raped.

  I have rarely heard anything so outrageous, and I used to investigate rape and abuse in my profession.

  It may be possible to identify who the elders on the JC were. (Any suggestions gratefully received). They should be named and shamed as individuals. After all, if they felt they were acting on the instructions of their god, they'd be happy to justify it, right? And would be happy to explain to people they meet in D2D or on the carts why they did this. And to justify to their wives and families why this was necessary and commanded by their god?

  My main point is this (sorry if I repeat myself). Forget JWs, theological stuff, reduce it to basics. How can this possibly have happened?

  (Declaration of interest: I was never a JW. My daughter was raped at 17.)
  
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  39

  Child Abuse - "I don't care. I haven't got any children".

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  earlier this week i bumped into a couple of jws who i recognised from the cult cart.

  a few months ago i had a long conversation with him one of them and found him to be quite friendly.

  he is new to the area in the years since i left.. this time he was very defensive and said he wasn't allowed to talk to me.

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  Joe Grundy

  Difficult to find the words to describe this comment. Bet he felt proud of himself afterwards (not). And would feel even prouder if his non JW associates (e.g. in the workplace) heard him say it.

  Seems to me that when JWs know they have nothing to say they fall back on infantile comments.
  
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  50

  The Report - BBC Radio 4 about Jehovah's Witnesses and Child Sexual Abuse can now be heard

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0612hjs.

  the report about child abuse and jehovah's witnesses is now live.. jehovah's witnesses handle child abuse cases.

  jehovah's witnesses and child sexual abuse, the report - bbc radio 4 .

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  Joe Grundy

  "Perhaps this will inspire Britain to take the first step towards examining the 'charity' status of the WTBTS!"

  This is already under way with the Charity Commission. WTBTS has recently lost a tribunal case and has been ordered to hand over documents.
  
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  32

  BBC radio Prog " The Report" this week on JW Child Abuse

  by Phizzy in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0612hjs.

  to be broadcast at 20.00 hrs british summer time this thursday, available on bbc i-player shortly after broadcast..

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  Joe Grundy

  It was very well done, I think. Balanced and honest. Well done BBC!
  
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  25

  New BBC article on JW abuse

  by snare&racket in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is religion doing enough to root out abuse?.

  he would go upstairs, on the premise that he was saying a prayer with his niece, then sexually abuse her.

  mark sewell was sentenced to 14 years in prisonafterwards, the elders told her that as it was only her account against that of sewell, nothing more could be done.

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  Joe Grundy

  FreeGirl2006:

  " I know, as I was one of them"

  I am sorry. If the law enforcement authorities had known more/been better, that shouldn't have happened.

  I apologise for my individual failings, and for those of the system which let you down. I could have done more to find out about this evil cult, and the others, and to try to put things right. Sorry. Don't think that I don't think about this, bear this burden, every day.
  
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  25

  New BBC article on JW abuse

  by snare&racket in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is religion doing enough to root out abuse?.

  he would go upstairs, on the premise that he was saying a prayer with his niece, then sexually abuse her.

  mark sewell was sentenced to 14 years in prisonafterwards, the elders told her that as it was only her account against that of sewell, nothing more could be done.

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  Joe Grundy

  And a word (or more) about 'two witnesses'.

  In the UK - and in many other jurisdictions, I believe - this principle continues in the form of seeking corroboration. The problem is that ignorant, arrogant, untrained, unprofessional JW overlords do not understand the concept and certainly do not wish to apply it even if they were capable of doing so. I must reiterate my view most strongly that JW heirarchy must immediately stand aside from any investigation of abuse and that by not doing so they risk causing further harm to victims, fouling up a prosection and further damage. Their god has no place in this process.

  But a 'second witness' legally could include:

  - 'Early complaint'

  - Forensic evidence (DNA deposits, etc.)

  - Evidence that the perpetrator was at the locus at the time

  - Interview/admissions/lies from suspect

  - Physical fact evidence (e.g victim describes birthmark on perpetrator)

  - 'Similar fact' in serial cases (e.g. perpetrator had a fetish for certain acts/words)

  - Multiple independent complaints from victims

  It can readily be seen that JW elders etc. not only don't have the training/expertise to look at these aspects, it would be horrendous if they tried to do so.

  I never was a JW and I try not to be over-critical of all elders and leaders. But sadly, all of the ones I have met and engaged in conversation have proved to be mildly deceptive at best and outright liars at worst.

  I stand by my previous assertion on posts on this topic here. If while I was working in this field I had come across elders interfering in abuse investigations (even by following the 'flock' book) I would have arrested them for obstruction/attempting to pervert the course of justice.
  
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  25

  New BBC article on JW abuse

  by snare&racket in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is religion doing enough to root out abuse?.

  he would go upstairs, on the premise that he was saying a prayer with his niece, then sexually abuse her.

  mark sewell was sentenced to 14 years in prisonafterwards, the elders told her that as it was only her account against that of sewell, nothing more could be done.

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  Joe Grundy

  I'm looking forward to this programme. The fact that BBC R4 is widely (internationally) recognised as a good source of factual news reporting probably won't cut much ice with die-hard JWs (all criticsm must come from satanic sources and is a sign of persecution) but it will, I think, raise awareness outside JW circles. To the vast majority of the UK, JWs are a minority, quirky and irrelevant cult - but this issue may well raise some concerns. The ongoing Charity Commission investigation, court cases and reports in other publications (e.g. Private Eye) seem to be coming together. 'Quirky and irrelevant' is one thing, but those people who listen to this information are more likely to connect 'JW' and 'hidden child abuse' in their minds, I suggest.

  Not that JWs are the only ones, of course, but a balanced view suggests that the RC church, at least, has recognised the problem and is doing something about it.
  
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  57

  Shall I go to the meeting? Would you?

  by KateWild in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  hi guys,.

  i might go to the meeting.

  i stopped going in my heart properly in nov 2013, but i went to a couple of meetings to support a love one that was df'd and tried to teach them a little ttatt.. now another df'd loved one is coming to see me today and will likely encourage me to try and get ri'd, and i want to support her.

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  Joe Grundy

  Dear Kate/Sam

  I never was a JW, but I think I understand a lot about them/it.

  You have a new life going for you, a bloke you're getting on well with, and a lot to look forward to.

  My advice would be walk away and don't be tempted to turn around and look back. You don't want to end up as a pillar of salt, do you?
  
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  42

  How much damage has internet done against the The Watchtower Society ?

  by opusdei1972 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in the beginning of internet the society was worried about the information published exposing its falsehood.

  so, i wonder how many people lost the society on account of forums and web sites like this.

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  Joe Grundy

  I never was a JW, but my view is (as expressed by others here previously) that most committed JWs would be unswayed by - and quickly move away from - 'apostate' information. But all it takes is one motivational push, an argument or slight by someone else at the KH, or knowing someone involved in a child abuse case, or the irrational closure/sale of a KH, and that would be enough of a spur for many JWs to be prepared to read some of the vast amount of information available.

  They might close their eyes, but once you've read it you can't un-read it and it WILL have an effect.